30% mix - fueling experts chime in

[WildHorse]

This year I'm going to do the E30 blend (91 octane plus One Ethanol S)
The trims should handle 30% no problemo, correct ?
Gen 3 Intake + stock gen 2 injectors if that matters. Thanks.

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[Andy13186]

go at least e50 imo. What tune are you even on?

 

[K4fxd]

Gen 3 Intake + stock gen 2 injectors if that matters. Thanks.

You will be at or over 85% for injector duty at 7200. This is off the top of my head. Might be higher or a bit lower depending on your mass air flow. Watch it closely the first few times.

I've run the GT350 manifold on E85 with stock gen 2 injectors it was 95% at 7500. So I no longer run actual 85%

 

[Angrey]

As K4Fxd pointed out, your bigger issue will be running out of injector vs short term and long term fuel trims. That can be solved by running higher pressure, but that involves a tune, which it seems you're trying to avoid.

I've seen others make claims that the OE calibration can handle up to E30 without issue, but keep this in mind, the calibration has limits on how much it will adjust and if you're taking up all that with fuel volume, you leave yourself no room for corrections for OTHER things.

 

[WildHorse]

go at least e50 imo. What tune are you even on?

91.

You will be at or over 85% for injector duty at 7200

You sure ? Thought it be closer to 75% ?

but that involves a tune, which it seems you're trying to avoid.

Not really avoiding. But if I don't have too.. all the better.
I know the factory calibration is for up to 15%. I do have
a BAP.

 

[K4fxd]

You sure ? Thought it be closer to 75% ?

Just have to try it. My car ran 85% but with the GT350 manifold at 30% E

Looking back at old logs and I don't have DA data. I've seen -2000 in the winter.

 

[Pistol_91]

I never have understood the want for running e30. What's the benefits? A couple degrees of timing? The PCM is already adding timing anyway considering the stock calibration is tuned for 87 octane. Timing advance is probably already tapped out with running 91. I doubt you will notice any difference with a butt dyno especially if you're N/A still.

 

[WildHorse]

What's the benefits?

Speaking stickly NA, timing wise, e30 will get all the sauce. There no more timing benefits beyond E30. However, with E30 + higher, you do get cooling benefits. Cooling means you can pack more air/fuel into the cylinder. That's why you make more horsepower on cooler days.

Ford logic will keep adding timing until the knock sensors get pissed off (and other factors, but less so).

 

[Pistol_91]

Speaking stickly NA, timing wise, e30 will get all the sauce. There no more timing benefits beyond E30. However, with E30 + higher, you do get cooling benefits. Cooling means you can pack more air/fuel into the cylinder. That's why you make more horsepower on cooler days.

Ford logic will keep adding timing until the knock sensors get pissed off (and other factors, but less so).

I understand that... I'm saying realistically in the real world. Like literally how much power do you think you will gain? The power difference between a hot day and cool day aren't that much. What maybe 5-10hp max?
The logic is if advance is set to add 8 degrees and you're already adding 8 degrees nearing mbt or at it, it's not going to add anymore. You can reach near mbt with good 93 N/A.
I just don't see the benefits for the inconvenience that's all. I'm a 93 or e85 or nothin guy. I would be curious to see what your findings were though, once you try it out.

 

[WildHorse]

I would be curious to see what your findings were though, once you try it out.

Stay tooned.

 

[WildHorse]

For those who like science stuff:
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0016236121015106#

 

[deanm11]

I understand that... I'm saying realistically in the real world. Like literally how much power do you think you will gain? The power difference between a hot day and cool day aren't that much. What maybe 5-10hp max?
The logic is if advance is set to add 8 degrees and you're already adding 8 degrees nearing mbt or at it, it's not going to add anymore. You can reach near mbt with good 93 N/A.
I just don't see the benefits for the inconvenience that's all. I'm a 93 or e85 or nothin guy. I would be curious to see what your findings were though, once you try it out.

Our cars are significantly knock limited. Timing from the midrange allows solid gains over 93 by using Ethanol blends.

 

[wingnutt]

subscribed…just to see where this leads 🥸

 

[Pistol_91]

Our cars are significantly knock limited. Timing from the midrange allows solid gains over 93 by using Ethanol blends.

E30... Not much

 

[K4fxd]

subscribed…just to see where this leads 🥸

It's fine to use E30. The only reason for @WildHorse to do a check log is because he has a 18 intake manifold on a gen 2 coyote with gen 2 injectors. The 18 manifold reves higher and flows more air than the gen 2 manifold.

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