The New 2017 ZL1 Camaro

[02gtnh]

All the performance figures gm advertise for there zl1 super car is for the a10 if there car is so great why don't they (gm) release the performance figures for the only transmission available the m6 are they that embarrassed

At least they give performance numbers so people have a idea what there buying. What does Ford give you?:shrug:

Sponsored

 

[Voodooo]

Bottomline::: lets see a GT 350R verse Zl1 head to head....I have been looking and any GT350R you can realistically get is over 75K...while the ZL1 is about 60K....trans, weight, bla bla bla..its an ICONIC ALL AROUND VEHICLE that is more than the equal of the GT350R>>>>>>

Until the blower belt breaks or it over heats than its over for the ZL1. lmao. Or let's put a Whipple on a R and call it equal and see what happens.

 

[boosted12]

whatever.. gm racing warranty! want to see that on a ford product

 

[Voodooo]

whatever.. gm racing warranty!

Another one huh? You think GM honors racing warranties? LMAO

 

[Childs Play]

Another one huh? You think GM honors racing warranties? LMAO

I know they do for track days. A guy in our club is out at the track often and has had it pulled into the shop a couple times from issues at the track. The weirdest one was his airbags deploying on a banked slope. Maybe that's not exactly warranty though.:shrug:

But they do. I've seen it.

 

[Childs Play]

Why is thepill not entitled to his opinion and you and others are? So what if he's against camaros. This is after all a mustang forum. Don't tell me the clowns on the Camaro forum don't hate on the mustang. We already have some Camaro guys on this forum because they say the Camaro guys are worse over there.

The problem is it isn't just an opinion normally. Usually he's trying to convey BS as facts.

Every once and a while he's right. But he talks like he's always right and he's generally always wrong. Even stuff he's blatantly wrong on, he keeps talking about like it's right.

He's banned on forums because most forums don't put up with crap like his.

That being said. Both sides hate on each other. It's called a rivalry. And if it wasn't for that rivalry, most likely neither side would have the cars they do.

 

[02gtnh]

What has been "answered" before?

Did we get an official word from Chevy as to what the issue is? Did we get any word from them on the drastic weight gains in the 1LE already?

Have they ever explained WHY a Camaro is thousands more compared to the Mustang? Or the effects of a cage or bar at Nurburgring? Did they ever talk about a supercharger during the "Z/28" heritage montage?

Lap times are great and all but doing them all by yourself on a track nobody release lap times for is a waste of money. Ford just bullied the greatest road course Camaro ever built in the z28 and Chevy isn't going to develop a competitive option?

Why are we including a Camaro in any H2H's? Seriously... I think it's Corvette time. I'd rather the Mistang get locked into a real battle with a real competitor. Nobody has time for Ring runs that Chevy needs to dump 7 months of prep into to run. They could of had an NA V8 by now...

You make no sense whatsoever.

 

[Childs Play]

What has been "answered" before?

Did we get an official word from Chevy as to what the issue is? Did we get any word from them on the drastic weight gains in the 1LE already? Gained ~70 lbs. STOP THE F***ING PRESSES!

Have they ever explained WHY a Camaro is thousands more compared to the Mustang? Much more included in the base model compared to the Mustang. This has been beaten to death. Not surprising you decided to bring it back up. You're great at beating dead horses.
Or the effects of a cage or bar at Nurburgring? Witchcraft happens and you go faster..? If it rolls over you don't die? I mean what are you even looking for with this question?
Did they ever talk about a supercharger during the "Z/28" heritage montage? Not sure what this is even trying to go after. Probably the same category as 70 lbs being drastic...

Lap times are great and all but doing them all by yourself on a track nobody release lap times for is a waste of money. By nobody do you mean almost every manufacture out there including Mercedes, Ferrari, Lamborghini, Chevrolet, Porsche, Nissan, Dodge, BMW, and pretty much every other manufacturer but Ford? Is that what you meant by nobody?
Ford just bullied the greatest road course Camaro ever built in the z28 and Chevy isn't going to develop a competitive option? The ZL1 (the non-track track car) just beat it. Once again. A useless thepillism. And really. Who cares because both cars are great and either car could win depending on the driver most likely.

Why are we including a Camaro in any H2H's? Seriously... I think it's Corvette time. I'd rather the Mistang get locked into a real battle with a real competitor. You mean like the ZL1 beating the GT350R's supposed time around the Nurburgring? That type of real competitor? Or did it need to lose 200 lbs that it didn't really lose but did and have an extra 4 inches of track width plus have exactly 2.25 inches less or more of back leg room? I can't keep up with the laughable BS your dude-bro brain keeps coming up with.
Nobody has time for Ring runs that Chevy needs to dump 7 months of prep into to run. They could of had an NA V8 by now... You could have tried getting a GED at some point too. So....?

Responses in red. How do you come up with the stuff you type..?

 

[BaylorCorvette]

I know they do for track days. A guy in our club is out at the track often and has had it pulled into the shop a couple times from issues at the track. The weirdest one was his airbags deploying on a banked slope. Maybe that's not exactly warranty though.:shrug:

But they do. I've seen it.

And that person was me. I deployed the side curtain airbags and seat belt tensioners at Texas World Speedway going through Turn 7-8. Really weird occurrence since I didn't hit anything nor went off track. However it was a pretty good G load and it was a slick surface. GM replaced those under warranty. I now have a 2016 C7 Z51 that I've sent through the ringer, currently over 1,000 track miles logged. The only issue I've had is melted active fuel management actuators (tracking at TWS in over 95* temps for 30+ minutes at a time) that operate the butterfly valves pre muffler for when the engine goes into cylinder deactivation. GM also replaced those under warranty no questions asked.

I will say, GM has been great to work with when things have failed at the track. Assuming you haven't modified the car to cause said failure.

 

[thePill]

Responses in red. How do you come up with the stuff you type..?

Excuse me... the responses we are looking for is "official word" from the manufacturer. Not just some random person on the internet right?

Looking at the answers... blah...


Only 70lbs? Only in a magazine comparison, the other one was around 85lbs. But yes, it was waaaaaaaaaaaay off. They were just as off on the 1LE guess as thePill was from the 1SS weight. So... don't you want to know what happened? Why 100lbs magically appeared out of nowhere? I can't see any thing extra. When the Mustang GT gained 86lbs is was all over... now the 1LE missed the 230lbs weight loss goal and I want to know why.

You said the SS is more expensive than a GT because it comes with more standard features? It also shares 80% of its equipment with other vehicles. Not only is the platform cheap but the entire suspension, drivetrain and brakes came from other vehicles. I am sorry but there aren't enough standard features on an SS to make it $1000 more once all the shared cost are involved. Even the features that you are talking about came from other cars.

Heritage was a marketing term thrown around when the 2014 z28 came around. Does a supercharged ZL1 with 305/315's and an A10 sound like a "Z/28" to anybody? It sure doesn't fit Chevy's description of one.

Where is the manual ZL1's lap time? The 2016 BMW M4 GTS lapped the Ring in 7:27.9. Since Chevy whole heartedly feels the Camaro is a BMW M4 competitor, are you still impressed with the full auto ZL1's 7:29.6?

I don't think BMW is too concerned about anything Camaro. I doubt the 1LE can beat the ZL1 either...

Chevy hasn't come clean on any of the issues being discussed.

Why is the ZL1 $20,000 more than a 1LE? Why is an SS more than a GT being 90% shared? Where is the manuals performance? Why was the A10 delayed? Is the Heat issue corrected on the LT4/A10 combo? Shouldn't they call it a ZL1 Carbon and not cash grab on the z28? It won't really be a GT350 competitor with an LT4.

The thing to watch out for is the quick weight gain. Just as the S197 did from 2006 to 2007, structural reinforcement needed to be added to support the GT500. You can see at the 1LE's level, it already needs reinforcement.


The ZL1's promised 220lbs weight loss could only end up being 100lbs depending on how much metal was added. It is a shame they won't say where they removed the metal from on the SS because that is where thePill's 3780-3820lbs 1SS went ;)

Not many can checkmate the Camaro like thePill. You wanted to see where I got the 3780-3820lbs claim? You literally get to see them put it back on in order to get the platform to work for them. Eventually, the 80lbs you see on the 1LE will migrate over to the SS because it desperately needs the rigidy. There is more weight to come...

There are 50lbs of sub-frame connectors that should have been integrated into the structure like the Mustang and Corvette. Not much else they can do now... the platform rigidy isn't even equal to the ATS from which it was based on.

 

[thePill]

The only two cars that turned a lap at the Ring this year was the M4 GTS and ZL1. By my stopwatch a 7:27.9 is faster than a 7:29.6. When I said nobody cares, I really ment NOBODY. Even if they did, would they want to bother? The M4 already beat the ZL1... why do you want a H2H with a GT350? The only manufacturer that felt the need to publish a Ring run in the last 12 months got beat by the M4 and they are in the same class.

The amount of R&D dollars that went into a Ring Record run could have been used better elsewhere. The FIA's GT4 would have been a great start and now is the time to do it. While Chevy spent 7+ months tuning a ZL1 A10 for a 7:30 lap, Ferrari, Ford, BMW, Merc, Nissan... and about 15 others have been prepping cars for Motorsport. They have an LT4 with an A10 and that's about the extent of the Camaro's big guns.

The situation Chevy is in now is the manual ZL1 is absent and they are using the auto to make a performance gap between the z28 and ZL1 purely gains from the automatic. A manual equip'd ZL1 runs a 7:35 at the Ring and that is honestly pathetic. The M4 GTS is making use of a lot of its power and it handily beat Chevy's new Camaro :( That is rather alarming... all while getting people to forget, WHAT ABOUT LAP #2? When it heatsoaks and craps itself.

Chevy throws on a set of 305/325's, CC brakes and charges $80,000+ for it. What do you want Ford to do? Offer a SC'd GT350 with a 10 speed auto?

How about Chevy builds a GT350 competitor and then you can compare them. As it stands, both the ZL1 and "Z28" need a supercharger and A10 to be competitive with a GT350. If they couldn't handle the M4 GTS, they are gonna struggle with the GT350.

 

[02gtnh]

Pill, show me one time where Chevy said the 1le would loose 230lbs. The 1le only gained 70lbs over the base and it has bigger tires, mag ride, aero, Recaro seats, and bigger brakes. Now look how much the GTPP gains over the base with much less.

 

[thePill]

Pill, show me one time where Chevy said the 1le would loose 230lbs. The 1le only gained 70lbs over the base and it has bigger tires, mag ride, aero, Recaro seats, and bigger brakes. Now look how much the GTPP gains over the base with much less.

http://media.chevrolet.com/media/us...nt/Pages/news/us/en/2016/aug/0808-camaro.html

They still haven't changed it because there isn't enough people aware enough to call BS. They will stick with the marketing and tell people it lost 230lbs.

While the first two were weighted at 3736 and 374x, there are 1LE's out there that are on the higher end like 3750-3770lbs.

The 100lbs that was added back into the 1LE was all structural. It is quite literally the same weight removed from the SS that made a 3670lbs SS possible. They also changed the 13.79 inch rotors I reported on to a 13.6/13.3 set.

You will also find that once they removed the weight, it destroyed the Alpha's incredible 50/50 weight distribution. In little words, they took something that was good and made it bad.

Note the ZL1's projected 220lbs loss? I doubt we get that too...

 

[mustang_guy]

And that person was me. I deployed the side curtain airbags and seat belt tensioners at Texas World Speedway going through Turn 7-8. Really weird occurrence since I didn't hit anything nor went off track. However it was a pretty good G load and it was a slick surface. GM replaced those under warranty. I now have a 2016 C7 Z51 that I've sent through the ringer, currently over 1,000 track miles logged. The only issue I've had is melted active fuel management actuators (tracking at TWS in over 95* temps for 30+ minutes at a time) that operate the butterfly valves pre muffler for when the engine goes into cylinder deactivation. GM also replaced those under warranty no questions asked.

I will say, GM has been great to work with when things have failed at the track. Assuming you haven't modified the car to cause said failure.

Its a shame most companies in the automotive world offering performance cars dont do this. It should be normal practice in my opinion.

 

[Childs Play]

Its a shame most companies in the automotive world offering performance cars dont do this. It should be normal practice in my opinion.

It's interesting that they don't. The biggest fail I can think within the same type of idea regarding a warranty from beating on your car is when Nissan bragged about how the GTR could do 0-60 in under 3 seconds. They advertised it and flaunted it.

Oh and, by the way. If you did it and launched the car to accomplish this, your warranty was void.

That's been addressed and this quite a long time ago now, but that seemed ridiculous to me when I first found out about it back when the car first launched. Why would you advertise something like that and then say the warranty was void...? Oh hey our car can do this. We're really proud of that. Oh by the way it really can't more then a couple of times or it will explode. And it's your fault.

Maybe that's just me though. :shrug:

Sponsored