Who will swap for the new 7.3 V8!

[bootlegger]

Except for the scored and scratched cylinder walls and scuffed pistons.
'15 - '17 Coyotes have had the same problem.....just not as often.
Swap to the 7.3 and be piston slap free.

No. Just no. Stop talking out your ass.
The tick noises often happen after the engine is warm, thus have no relation to piston slap. Oh master drag racer, do you have any experience with forged pistons?
Piston scuffing has only been seen in a handful of engines, and there is no correlation to engine tick. For example, there are a couple 18+ owners who had no tick, yet had slight scoring that they related to engine rattle at 2k rpm. However, some guys with the rattle have no scoring. Basically, no relation. Ford also released a TSB stating the tick was normal, and not related to any failures.

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[Maggneto]

In order for the three stooges to show the world they are right about the 7.3 being the best engine for the Mustang, they need a 7.3 engine, which they don't have and likely never will.

And since the 7.3 in its current state is designed for heavy duty truck applications, it will suck major ass in a performance car so they need to rebuild the engine with parts that don't exist. How do we know, because a subject matter expert on Ford gas engines with the most knowledge of the 7.3 says so, which holds more weight than members of M6G who have no access to the 7.3 engine or information and only argument is "no one knows". This is false, as previously stated, a subject matter expert is "someone".

Putting the 7.3 in a Mustang in its current state would result in a 70k Mustang that is slightly faster than an F250 with the same engine. That means a daily as whooping at the drag strip from Ecoboost Mustangs, forget about the SC 5.0. On the positive side, you may win a peel "oot" contest in your home town.

So once the 7.3 is rebuilt for performance to compete at the track they need to do the engine swap with a much heavier engine that is longer than what came out. This will require a complete overhaul of the engine compartment, suspension, brakes, and a host of other changes. Unless of course you are Mill and Fatguy who are going with the V6 suspension and brakes. And if you are Fatguy who is going with the OEM 7.3 as well, it will only cost 10k.

So after a few years and tens of thousands of dollars (only 10k for Fatguy of course) you have a car that is still getting a daily ass whooping at the track by boosted Mustangs, Ecoboost and Coyote alike that will likely crash into the back of a car because it can't stop or get out of it's own way.

Of course you can always prove me wrong right? So which one of you is going to do the swap and what is the ETA of the Super Duty Mustang Cobra F250 iron block dream machine?

 

[Fatguy]

In order for the three stooges to show the world they are right about the 7.3 being the best engine for the Mustang, they need a 7.3 engine, which they don't have.

And since the 7.3 in its current state is designed for heavy duty truck applications, it will suck major ass in a performance car so they need to rebuild the engine with parts that don't exist.

Putting the 7.3 in a Mustang in its current state would result in a 70k Mustang that is slightly faster than an F250 with the same engine. That means a daily as whooping at the drag strip from Ecoboost Mustangs, forget about the SC 5.0. On the positive side, you may win a peel "oot" contest in your home town.

So once the 7.3 is rebuilt for performance to compete at the track they need to do the engine swap with a much heavier engine that is longer than what came out. This will require a complete overhaul of the engine compartment, suspension, brakes, and a host of other changes. Unless of course you are Mill and Fatguy who are going with the V6 suspension and brakes.

So after a few years and tens of thousands of dollars you have a car that is still getting a daily as whooping at the track by boosted Mustangs, Ecoboost and Coyote alike that will likely crash into the back of a car because it can't stop or get out of it's own way.

Remove the first two paragraphs and the last and you have a proper argument. There are more than three who agree to the swap, they just don’t need the aggravation.

As for price my swap costs 51,000 in addition to the purchase price according to you. Unrealistically high. If you stop comparing - things become more understandable.


I want a Big Block! The others are not arguments. That is the argument! All the comparisons fail because of that. Your failure to realize the fallacy of your reasoning - ignoring that it must be a big block - is quite obvious here. Compare swaps with other big blocks. Or compare the opportunity cost to getting a C6 Z06 even if the big block argument is shaky. But even the head of Ford motors agrees that the 7.3 is a big block. It will be longer because it is a big block. I can settle for the fitment problems cause all true big blocks will have that problem.


I want my Big Block!

 

[bootlegger]

I want my Big Block!

Stop talking and get to work. There are already options out there for you.

 

[Maggneto]

Remove the first two paragraphs and the last and you have a proper argument. There are more than three who agree to the swap, they just don’t need the aggravation.

As for price my swap costs 51,000 in addition to the purchase price according to you. Unrealistically high. If you stop comparing - things become more understandable.


I want a Big Block! The others are not arguments. That is the argument! All the comparisons fail because of that. Your failure to realize the fallacy of your reasoning - ignoring that it must be a big block - is quite obvious here. Compare swaps with other big blocks. Or compare the opportunity cost to getting a C6 Z06 even if the big block argument is shaky. But even the head of Ford motors agrees that the 7.3 is a big block. It will be longer because it is a big block. I can settle for the fitment problems cause all true big blocks will have that problem.


I want my Big Block!

If you remove everything you just said there is a valid argument? You gotta love this guy. Why not run for office, you would make an excellent politician. (Oh Christ, I just added another 2000 replies to this ridiculous thread)

Why don't you get an estimate from a professional engine builder and get back to us instead of dreaming up numbers. Oh right, THERE IS NO ENGINE so how can you get an estimate eh? How do you know the cost of the engine, parts and labor? We don't, but let's debate it anyway.

Any who, what is stopping you from getting the 7.3 big block, oh that's right, THERE IS NO ENGINE but let's debate how great, cheap and easy it will be once released.

 

[millhouse]

When you run outta curve at 5000 rpm while you opponent is ripping to 7000 in a lighter package means NEWTON was right.

YOU: get a high stall converter
ME: Dump the clutch higher
YOU: more gear then
ME: Great you ran outta RPM sooner
YOU: but but but
ME: I beat him, back off
EVIL ME: Make it buses, make him sell it.

Again, you are failing to understand that it's the area under the curve that matters, not where it's located in the RPM band. 450hp at 7000 rpm is all fine and dandy until you realize your HP curve has an extremely narrow power band.

Say it with me one time...AREA UNDER THE CURVE.

And since the 7.3 in its current state is designed for heavy duty truck applications, it will suck major ass in a performance car

Let's stop right there. You have yet to provide any information as to why. I'd love to hear your reasoning. "But truck engine" and "But Iron block" aren't valid responses. Unless you have some type of argument here, your rhetoric is complete and utter B.S.

so they need to rebuild the engine with parts that don't exist.

Again, put up or shut up. Why? What is the 7.3L lacking? It already has 4 bolt mains (+2 cross bolts), forged crank, 10.5:1 CR, coated pistons with cooling jets, high flow heads, high flow intake, hydraulic roller lifters, aluminum roller rockers, beehive springs etc, What else needs to rebuilt, do tell.

Quite frankly, the only thing this engine will need to FAR exceed the coyote is a different cam...which is an easy endeavor for any manufacturer. Unless you think that only an LS engine can benefit from a cam swap because it isn't just a truck engine.

How do we know, because a subject matter expert on Ford gas engines with the most knowledge of the 7.3 says so, which holds more weight than members of M6G who have no access to the 7.3 engine or information and only argument is "no one knows". This is false, as previously stated, a subject matter expert is "someone".

Why don't you post again where he says the 7.3L is going to be less capable than the coyote, or that it's not going to be able to outperform the coyote. You sir have an issue with reading comprehension. The only thing he says is, the coyote is a better fit for the mustang. That's it. He never says the 7.3 wouldn't be faster. He never says the 7.3 wouldn't be more capable. He never says the 7.3L couldn't be more fun.

Putting the 7.3 in a Mustang in its current state would result in a 70k Mustang that is slightly faster than an F250 with the same engine. That means a daily as whooping at the drag strip from Ecoboost Mustangs, forget about the SC 5.0. On the positive side, you may win a peel "oot" contest in your home town.

I'd love to hear how you think an engine with 450+hp in a <4000lb vehicle is going to be only "slightly faster" than a 450+hp engine in a 7500lb vehicle. Seriously, do tell. Again, "but truck engine" and "but iron block" aren't reasons. I'm still waiting for an explanation on why truck engine hp < car engine hp.

So once the 7.3 is rebuilt for performance to compete at the track they need to do the engine swap with a much heavier engine that is longer than what came out. This will require a complete overhaul of the engine compartment, suspension, brakes, and a host of other changes. Unless of course you are Mill and Fatguy who are going with the V6 suspension and brakes. And if you are Fatguy who is going with the OEM 7.3 as well, it will only cost 10k.

Fair enough. That v6 is going to need a set of v8 springs and dampers. Do you really think that's going to put a dent on the budget? Hell, I'd recommend anyone doing this swap to look into a full adjustable suspension setup to get the most out of the torque off the line at the drag-strip, as some seriously sticky tires are going to be necessary.

So after a few years and tens of thousands of dollars (only 10k for Fatguy of course) you have a car that is still getting a daily ass whooping at the track by boosted Mustangs, Ecoboost and Coyote alike that will likely crash into the back of a car because it can't stop or get out of it's own way.

Fatguy will be laughing all the way to the bank when he has an engine combo far more capable than the coyote. He'll be able to make 600+hp N/A without a problem and won't have to worry about re-sleaving the block if he ever decides to move to higher power levels. The 7.3L engine is going to be able to make more power than the coyote could ever dream of...and it will be able to do it for cheaper and more reliably. The coyote needs more rpm to move more air, and let's not pretend that it's going to live at 8000+RPM for a long time.

 

[bootlegger]

If you remove everything you just said there is a valid argument? You gotta love this guy. Why not run for office, you would make an excellent politician. (Oh Christ, I just added another 2000 replies to this ridiculous thread)

Why don't you get an estimate from a professional engine builder and get back to us instead of dreaming up numbers. Oh right, THERE IS NO ENGINE so how can you get an estimate eh? How do you know the cost of the engine, parts and labor? We don't, but let's debate it anyway.

Any who, what is stopping you from getting the 7.3 big block, oh that's right, THERE IS NO ENGINE but let's debate how great, cheap and easy it will be once released.

There are other options for him, which are much easier to work with. As mentioned before, the 427 would give him big block performance, even though it is based on the bigger small block 351. Iron block, pushrod, and old school proven design. That, or just buy an LS. They are basically a dime a dozen, and have full aftermarket support (which you won't see for years on the Ford 7.3).

 

[Fatguy]

If you remove everything you just said there is a valid argument? You gotta love this guy. Why not run for office, you would make an excellent politician. (Oh Christ, I just added another 2000 replies to this ridiculous thread)

Why don't you get an estimate from a professional engine builder and get back to us instead of dreaming up numbers. Oh right, THERE IS NO ENGINE so how can you get an estimate eh? How do you know the cost of the engine, parts and labor? We don't, but let's debate it anyway.

Any who, what is stopping you from getting the 7.3 big block, oh that's right, THERE IS NO ENGINE but let's debate how great, cheap and easy it will be once released.

You are actually sort of right there.


I always wanted a big block but those from the actual era won’t do because they are just old worn out cars. I gave up on the idea until the press releases came out about the 7.3! So now that dream could become flesh. Then I started the thread.


A fair chunk of this thread was about the difficulties involved and that actually was educational for me and a pile of other readers. But the comparisons to the Coyote are superfluous because if it was just performance I would just buy the Vette as the original plan was. So to get an unquestionable big block experience it would have to be a swap.


As I see it GTpony was the only one who kept his head focused on the big picture giving me real practical alternatives to satisfying the feel or the necessary prerequisite of the big block. I’m still looking at C6 Z06 cars because of him.


If I do pull the trigger on the swap and make a documentary, the prologue will be about how I always wanted a big block first, and that the only way to make that happen would be a swap to the 7.3. To be fair it would be fun to race all sorts of cars after the swap, to put all that effort into perspective - even if it doesn’t go my way - It’s entertainment after all...

 

[Maggneto]

The person with the most insight into the 7.3 has this to say about the prospects of the 7.3 in the Mustang.

"And if you're wondering if it'll fit in a Mustang, Beltramo told us it's actually shorter in height and narrower than a Coyote V-8, but quite a bit longer thanks to much increased bore centers. It's possible then, but good luck doing so without having to cut into the firewall. And even if you could wedge this motor into a Mustang, it wouldn't be very good, because of its heavy cast iron block and low-revving nature. Stick with the Coyote, kids."

A reasonable person reads that and says, hmmmm, maybe the head of gas engines at Ford knows what he is talking aboot.

Here is the response of a delusional person.

"Why don't you post again where he says the 7.3L is going to be less capable than the coyote, or that it's not going to be able to outperform the coyote. You sir have an issue with reading comprehension. The only thing he says is, the coyote is a better fit for the mustang. That's it. He never says the 7.3 wouldn't be faster. He never says the 7.3 wouldn't be more capable. He never says the 7.3L couldn't be more fun."

You should concentrate more on what is being said then what is not being said. After all, he is clearly saying the 7.3 will not be any good, gives the reasons why it will not be any good, and to stick with the Coyote.

 

[millhouse]

There are other options for him, which are much easier to work with. As mentioned before, the 427 would give him big block performance, even though it is based on the bigger small block 351. Iron block, pushrod, and old school proven design. That, or just buy an LS. They are basically a dime a dozen, and have full aftermarket support (which you won't see for years on the Ford 7.3).

The Windsor block is not the most robust block on the planet. You're starting off with 1/2 inch, 2 bolt mains with thin webbing. The caps will start walking at 650+hp, so you're looking at a 700hp limit...unless you drop some serious money on a billet 4 bolt main block (but there goes your budget). This new 7.3L offers a beefy 4 bolt big block with updated technology. The Windsor stopped advancing a long time ago...and is pretty much maxed out at 427. Don't get me wrong, I loved my 427 in my sn95...but would have easily swapped in a 7.3L instead given the choice. I wouldn't be surprised if the heads on this 7.3L flowed more than the trcik flow 205 heads I had on my 427.

As for aftermarket support, I would give it less than a year before you start seeing aftermarket cams and CNC head programming for that engine. Every major mustang and hot rod shop is going to have their hands on that (possibly before it's released) as people are going to want to swap it in anything and everything. Quite frankly, that alone could be the biggest downfall. Too much demand could raise pricing out of reason.

 

[Fatguy]

The person with the most insight into the 7.3 has this to say about the prospects of the 7.3 in the Mustang.

"And if you're wondering if it'll fit in a Mustang, Beltramo told us it's actually shorter in height and narrower than a Coyote V-8, but quite a bit longer thanks to much increased bore centers. It's possible then, but good luck doing so without having to cut into the firewall. And even if you could wedge this motor into a Mustang, it wouldn't be very good, because of its heavy cast iron block and low-revving nature. Stick with the Coyote, kids."

A reasonable person reads that and says, hmmmm, maybe the head of gas engines at Ford knows what he is talking aboot. After all, he is clearly saying the 7.3 will not be any good and to stick with the Coyote.

Here is the response of a delusional person.

Why don't you post again where he says the 7.3L is going to be less capable than the coyote, or that it's not going to be able to outperform the coyote. You sir have an issue with reading comprehension. The only thing he says is, the coyote is a better fit for the mustang. That's it. He never says the 7.3 wouldn't be faster. He never says the 7.3 wouldn't be more capable. He never says the 7.3L couldn't be more fun.

What he is saying (the head of gas engines) is: Go to your nearest Ford dealer and buy a Mustang GT. Spoken like a true manager...

 

[millhouse]

The person with the most insight into the 7.3 has this to say about the prospects of the 7.3 in the Mustang.

"And if you're wondering if it'll fit in a Mustang, Beltramo told us it's actually shorter in height and narrower than a Coyote V-8, but quite a bit longer thanks to much increased bore centers. It's possible then, but good luck doing so without having to cut into the firewall. And even if you could wedge this motor into a Mustang, it wouldn't be very good, because of its heavy cast iron block and low-revving nature. Stick with the Coyote, kids."

A reasonable person reads that and says, hmmmm, maybe the head of gas engines at Ford knows what he is talking aboot. After all, he is clearly saying the 7.3 will not be any good and to stick with the Coyote.

Here is the response of a delusional person.

Why don't you post again where he says the 7.3L is going to be less capable than the coyote, or that it's not going to be able to outperform the coyote. You sir have an issue with reading comprehension. The only thing he says is, the coyote is a better fit for the mustang. That's it. He never says the 7.3 wouldn't be faster. He never says the 7.3 wouldn't be more capable. He never says the 7.3L couldn't be more fun.

Reading comprehension kids.

Where does he say it would be slower in the 1/4 mile?

Where does he say it's going to be less capable?

A reasonable person reads that and thinks...hey, the coyote is a better fit...BUT DOES NOT INFER ANYTHING ELSE. You know what, a 700hp NA high revving 500+cubic inch big block chevy would be a TERRIBLE fit in an s550. That doesn't mean it would be slower in the 1/4 mile though, does it?

You have not offered any evidence to the contrary...zip, zero, zilch.

Keep trying kid.

 

[millhouse]

What he is saying (the head of gas engines) is: Go to your nearest Ford dealer and buy a Mustang GT. Spoken like a true manager...

Exactly! That's all he's saying. The coyote absolutely is a better fit. It's better for the vehicles dynamics. It's better for handling. It's better for 99% of people looking to buy a mustang. Can you imagine the shitstorm he'd be in if he mentioned it would be faster than the coyote if swapped into a mustang? You just don't go around poo pooing on the mustang chief engineers.

It's NOT better for those looking for something different.
It's NOT better for max NA horsepower applications.
It's NOT better for max FI horsepower applications.

 

[Fatguy]

And guys if you think I hate engineermike or maggneto you are wrong. I would love to get them on video talking as they do here. Saying things like the swapped car would suck ass as a performance car! Great stuff. Would really get the audience’s attention and keep them interested.


No hatred here on my part. It’s all good!

 

[Maggneto]

What he is saying (the head of gas engines) is: Go to your nearest Ford dealer and buy a Mustang GT. Spoken like a true manager...

Fatguy, your mind works like a broken clock.

In order to swap a 7.3 in a Mustang you need a Mustang right? Or do things work differently in Canada where you are going to do an engine swap without the car?

So you need a Mustang from Ford (cha-ching)
The 7.3 from Ford (more cha-ching-ching)
The Ford Performance parts (cha-ching-ching-ching)

So Joe is purposely sabotaging the Ford 7.3 by encouraging the Ford 5.0 because Joe knows the 7.3 is actually the better engine despite Joe stating the opposite?

How much weed have you smoked this morning?

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