mattlqx track prep and adventures

[mattlqx]

Great thread.

Curious to know how you feel the Mach1 compares to your previous gt350 on the track.

Thanks!

Good question and hard to quantify since they were over 4 years apart and I haven't run any of the same tracks so I can't compare any sort of times. I think they're both great out of the box though.

Having less horsepower isn't noticeable on the driving experience and I rather prefer the torque curve of the M1 over the 350 despite the fact there a few places at Podium Club that I could've used the extra thousand RPM rather than either holding or shifting for a few seconds before the next turn.

The aero on the HP car is so well sorted though and I could tell a definitely difference running the gurney flap vs not when it came to lift around small hills and high-speed cornering. For a little while I was running an APR wing on the 350 which is massive, but I never really got the opportunity to run it more aggressively. Still for almost everyone driving this car, that gurney flap on/off is enough adjustability.

I'm pretty excited about what I think is going to be a great feature on the M1 that the 350 lacked, quiet mode. We have a track here in town, Arizona Motorsports Park, that's limited to 96db, and another notable track with sound limit is Laguna Seca. In the 350, I plugged the open side of the exhausts with a rubber stopper which did work so I could run AMP, but it was, well, hokey. From what I've experienced so far, the car does run in quiet mode continuous when in it, so I look forward being able to run AMP without the need for hacking the exhaust.

HP car coming with camber plates was very nice (despite the fact you have to annoyingly remove the set screws for any adjustment). I just set it to max and didn't have any problem in tight low speed corners. I remember the 350 being a little looser, could be down to a lot of things including my memory but I declare the M1 to be the best handling car I've owned.

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[Traffic22]

In one of your early posts you mentioned you were swapping to SS brake lines….did you ever make the swap? Which ones?

Are you still running OEM brakes? No problems with glazing or fade so far?

 

[mattlqx]

In one of your early posts you mentioned you were swapping to SS brake lines….did you ever make the swap? Which ones?

Are you still running OEM brakes? No problems with glazing or fade so far?

Yep. Did them with the hubs and also swapped to the locking pins for the front calipers. Lines and pins from OPMustang. And also swapped fluid to ATE 200.

The stock pads were fine. Did many 135mph -> 40mph stops at the end of the straight last time out. No fade, I haven't taken off the pads to look at them, but they feel completely normal. Not sure what pads I'll go with as replacements. Gotta look at the options, but on my 350s, I just kept running stock pads and they were great except for all the dust.

 

[Traffic22]

Yep. Did them with the hubs and also swapped to the locking pins for the front calipers. Lines and pins from OPMustang. And also swapped fluid to ATE 200.

The stock pads were fine. Did many 135mph -> 40mph stops at the end of the straight last time out. No fade, I haven't taken off the pads to look at them, but they feel completely normal. Not sure what pads I'll go with as replacements. Gotta look at the options, but on my 350s, I just kept running stock pads and they were great except for all the dust.

Thanks so much for the links and tips. I was going to swap to race pads, but maybe I’ll give the stockers a try first. And thanks for the link to the lines and pins. Never even thought about doing the pins, seems like cheap insurance.

Fluid will be swapped for sure. I know Ford uses a dot 4, but I can’t find any boiling point info on it, so just don’t trust it. I’m a Motul 660 fan, we’ve been using it in our heavy ass Lemons car with very good results.

Appreciate all the help.

 

[mustang5o]

I'll start be reiterating what others have said...Great thread! Great info for those looking to make these changes. I just picked up my 2023 M1 from Granger Ford on Friday. It's getting PPF this week and I knew I had to start looking for hub bolts as I have ARP studs ready to go in. Just the front at first unless I can find another set in stock to do the rears.

So the conclusion as best we can tell was that my 2022 Mach 1 (10/2022 build) uses some of the same parts on the front suspension as the 2024 Mustang. If you ever want to replace the hubs/wheel bearings on your cars, keep my story of woe in mind. Maybe Ford will fix their catalog someday.

Part numbers and spec
Rear Hub to Knuckle Bolts: W718188-S439, 98 ft/lbs
Rear Axle Nut: CCPZ-3B477-G, 98 ft/lbs plus 45 degrees
Front Hub: PR3C-2C299-AB
Front Knuckle: NR3C-3K171-AA (Left), NR3C-3K170-AA (Right)
Front Hub to Knuckle Bolts: W721525-S439, 111 ft/lbs

So when I pull the front hubs I'll just be replacing the Front Hub to Knuckle Bolts: W721525-S439 correct? Are they four in a pack so two packs? Again, I'm using the existing hub and just replacing the studs.

Then on the rears I'll need both the:
Rear Hub to Knuckle Bolts: W718188-S439 (how many?)
Rear Axle Nut: CCPZ-3B477-G (two of these I presume)

Sold my Handling Pack wheels and ordered another set of APEX wheels. Buyer didn't want the Cup 2 tires and I could use them for a legal tire for Time Attack, so I went with a set of spendy forged 19x11" VS-5RS. Different offsets so its not a "square" setup. Arrived today and they're already getting mounted up right now.

You could have have gone 18x11 or 19x11 ET52 and used a 25mm spacer in the front to run square. That's how I (and others) did it (with my PP2) and confirmed with Cory at Apex for the M1. I currently have EC7's for track and I've thought about getting the 5RS' for my street tires because they look great. However, now that I've seen the HP wheels in person I might keep them. For now I have a set of black PP1 wheels for street but when the tires wear out I plan to put a (trackable) 200TW street tire on the HP wheels sell the PP1 wheels and get another set of something from Apex.

 

[mustang5o]

HP car coming with camber plates was very nice (despite the fact you have to annoyingly remove the set screws for any adjustment). I just set it to max and didn't have any problem in tight low speed corners. I remember the 350 being a little looser, could be down to a lot of things including my memory but I declare the M1 to be the best handling car I've owned.

I forgot I wanted to ask about this as well. I'm still reading threads on how to get the set screws out. Do they have to be put back in after you do your track alignment?

 

[mattlqx]

I'll start be reiterating what others have said...Great thread! Great info for those looking to make these changes. I just picked up my 2023 M1 from Granger Ford on Friday. It's getting PPF this week and I knew I had to start looking for hub bolts as I have ARP studs ready to go in. Just the front at first unless I can find another set in stock to do the rears.

Thanks, and congrats.

So when I pull the front hubs I'll just be replacing the Front Hub to Knuckle Bolts: W721525-S439 correct? Are they four in a pack so two packs? Again, I'm using the existing hub and just replacing the studs.

Then on the rears I'll need both the:
Rear Hub to Knuckle Bolts: W718188-S439 (how many?)
Rear Axle Nut: CCPZ-3B477-G (two of these I presume)

Numbers should be correct as I'd expect your '23 to be the same as mine. Packs of 4 bolts; one pack per wheel. Tim notes that:

One Point about these bolts, currently they are not available from Ford, clean the old ones and apply some thread locker and torque them to spec. They are not Torque to Yield (TTY)​

​

So if you don't end up muck the bolts on the way out, should be ok to re-use. They do take an extraordinary amount of effort to unbolt thanks to the stock red threadlocker.

Side note: for the rears, it's easier to just completely remove the knuckle than try to unbolt and rebolt the hub with just hinging the knuckle. You can use a vise or just stand on the knuckle to torque the bolts. Also be careful with the CV boot around the knuckle, there were a lot of burrs and sharp points on the knuckle that I managed to make small cut in one of the boots. That's why I've done both ways.

Definitely use a new axle nut every time.

You could have have gone 18x11 or 19x11 ET52 and used a 25mm spacer in the front to run square. That's how I (and others) did it (with my PP2) and confirmed with Cory at Apex for the M1. I currently have EC7's for track and I've thought about getting the 5RS' for my street tires because they look great. However, now that I've seen the HP wheels in person I might keep them. For now I have a set of black PP1 wheels for street but when the tires wear out I plan to put a (trackable) 200TW street tire on the HP wheels sell the PP1 wheels and get another set of something from Apex.

The fitment looks good at least with the different offsets using the same 15mm spacers on all wheels as the EC7s. I liked the look of the HP wheels too, but dropping the mass on each corner really woke the car up. Speaking of... I put on the VS-5RS and took them for a spin yesterday for the first time.

The 305 is stretched on the front, looks like a 315 would work fine there as on the rear.

I forgot I wanted to ask about this as well. I'm still reading threads on how to get the set screws out. Do they have to be put back in after you do your track alignment?

You have to drop the strut completely down from the mount to get access to the set screws, which required disconnecting the sway bar as well. The screws are there to lock it to the standard alignment, so once they're removed they stay out to allow for adjustments by just loosening the strut mounts.

 

[Coastal-Mach]

I forgot I wanted to ask about this as well. I'm still reading threads on how to get the set screws out. Do they have to be put back in after you do your track alignment?

From what I read, the set screws are only in from the factory to keep a generic alignment on each cars as they roll down the line. Discard them after removing and adjust as needed.

 

[Coastal-Mach]

Thanks, and congrats.



Packs of 4 bolts; one pack per wheel. Tim notes that:

One Point about these bolts, currently they are not available from Ford, clean the old ones and apply some thread locker and torque them to spec. They are not Torque to Yield (TTY)​

​

So if you don't end up muck the bolts on the way out, should be ok to re-use. They do take an extraordinary amount of effort to unbolt thanks to the stock red threadlocker.

Side note: for the rears, it's easier to just completely remove the knuckle than try to unbolt and rebolt the hub with just hinging the knuckle. You can use a vise or just stand on the knuckle to torque the bolts. Also be careful with the CV boot around the knuckle, there were a lot of burrs and sharp points on the knuckle that I managed to make small cut in one of the boots. That's why I've done both ways.

Definitely use a new axle nut every time.



The fitment looks good at least with the different offsets using the same 15mm spacers on all wheels as the EC7s. I liked the look of the HP wheels too, but dropping the mass on each corner really woke the car up. Speaking of... I put on the VS-5RS and took them for a spin yesterday for the first time.

The 305 is stretched on the front, looks like a 315 would work fine there as on the rear.

You have to drop the strut completely down from the mount to get access to the set screws, which required disconnecting the sway bar as well. The screws are there to lock it to the standard alignment, so once they're removed they stay out to allow for adjustments by just loosening the strut mounts.

I’m ready to install my VS-5RS as well. I went with the brushed clear. BTW, thanks for starting this thread.

 

[mustang5o]

Thanks, and congrats.

Numbers should be correct as I'd expect your '23 to be the same as mine. Packs of 4 bolts; one pack per wheel. Tim notes that:

One Point about these bolts, currently they are not available from Ford, clean the old ones and apply some thread locker and torque them to spec. They are not Torque to Yield (TTY)​

​

So if you don't end up muck the bolts on the way out, should be ok to re-use. They do take an extraordinary amount of effort to unbolt thanks to the stock red threadlocker.

Side note: for the rears, it's easier to just completely remove the knuckle than try to unbolt and rebolt the hub with just hinging the knuckle. You can use a vise or just stand on the knuckle to torque the bolts. Also be careful with the CV boot around the knuckle, there were a lot of burrs and sharp points on the knuckle that I managed to make small cut in one of the boots. That's why I've done both ways.

Definitely use a new axle nut every time.

The fitment looks good at least with the different offsets using the same 15mm spacers on all wheels as the EC7s. I liked the look of the HP wheels too, but dropping the mass on each corner really woke the car up. Speaking of... I put on the VS-5RS and took them for a spin yesterday for the first time.

The 305 is stretched on the front, looks like a 315 would work fine there as on the rear.

You have to drop the strut completely down from the mount to get access to the set screws, which required disconnecting the sway bar as well. The screws are there to lock it to the standard alignment, so once they're removed they stay out to allow for adjustments by just loosening the strut mounts.

OK so I don't need to replace either the front or rear hub bolts. If you remove the whole knuckle instead on the rears is the knuckle held on by torque to yield bolts?

Your car looks great with those wheels and stance is good. I've talked to some track guys who have done 315's all around (315/30/18 Hoosier A7) using the ET52's and aforementioned 25mm in the front.

From what I read, the set screws are only in from the factory to keep a generic alignment on each cars as they roll down the line. Discard them after removing and adjust as needed.

Thanks! I was hoping that was the case. I will do what I did on my last car and use a clear plexiglass plate to make a template of how the bolts and strut top align now. Then after I get a track alignment I can put the front back pretty close to stock using those template.

 

[Coastal-Mach]

That’s a good idea with the plexiglass template.

 

[mattlqx]

OK so I don't need to replace either the front or rear hub bolts. If you remove the whole knuckle instead on the rears is the knuckle held on by torque to yield bolts?

You have to unbolt most everything except the lower control arm if you're "hinging" it anyway. I reused all the various different bolts that connect to the knuckle. Didn't see anything that called out replacing those. I was using this chart for torque specs.

 

[mustang5o]

Great. Thanks again. Now I need to finish reading up on removing those strut top mount set screws.

 

[Coastal-Mach]

Great. Thanks again. Now I need to finish reading up on removing those strut top mount set screws.

From what I have read it’s a PITA

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