When installing new sway bars is it a must to upgrade to new ENDLINKS?

[mkcotton]

The stock links are most certainly not good enough for a 350. If you review my earlier comment, I, along with several others have bent the stock ones and I know of two broke clean in half.

Interesting... the part number for end-links for the PP1 with magneride and the Gt 350 are exactly the same. If you're road course racing almost no stock part will be good enough. The end-links are fine for daily & spirited driving...

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[luc]

Ok, I got it!!! Thanks dude. I'm just trying to figure out wtf is causing the clunking noise on front of Stang. Maybe I bent a link?

1 of my end link was slightly
Loose, key word here is slightly, and was creating a lot of slow speed clunking on the slightest bump

 

[TrackMustang]

how do you figure endlinks actually affect suspension movement?

sure if the parts are bad, replace them, but no sense spending money on things that do exactly what your old parts were doing and nothing more.

i did say replace any bent front endlinks.

Under that logic why replace the sway bars? It’s a better part built to higher standards… why replace anything on the car at all that isn’t bent? Increased performance.

Sway bars are typically built pretty well and don’t fail regularly. However, the end links get wear much faster (typically). The wear can cause front end clunk and cause issues that effect the way the sway bar works, even though the sway bar isn’t broken/damaged/worn.

 

[NightmareMoon]

Could a loose sway bar from moving. Around untightened damage an end link? And cause a racket..

A loose endlink to swaybar connection is a common place to get clunking noises.

If the swaybar doesn’t have built in locating collars, then they can have too much side to side motion, and you can get clamp on collars to keep them centered, but its far more common to just not get the endlink connections tight enough to stop those from moving a little and clunking.

 

[scoots]

If the car is lowered, wouldn’t you want to get adjustable end links to correct geometry?

 

[NightmareMoon]

Under that logic why replace the sway bars? It’s a better part built to higher standards… why replace anything on the car at all that isn’t bent? Increased performance.

Sway bars are typically built pretty well and don’t fail regularly. However, the end links get wear much faster (typically). The wear can cause front end clunk and cause issues that effect the way the sway bar works, even though the sway bar isn’t broken/damaged/worn.

Not at all. Swaybars are very simple parts. We don’t replace swaybars to get a higher quality part. Its just a piece of spring steel, the stock parts are well designed to do exactly the job they do.

We replace swaybars IF and ONLY IF want to change the amount of bar rate.

Sure endlink joints can fail eventually, but the most common source of clunking sounds are endlinks incorrectly torqed after a swaybar install.

 

[TrackMustang]

Not at all. Swaybars are very simple parts. We don’t replace swaybars to get a higher quality part. Its just a piece of spring steel, the stock parts are well designed to do exactly the job they do.

We replace swaybars IF and ONLY IF want to change the amount of bar rate.

Sure endlink joints can fail eventually, but the most common source of clunking sounds are endlinks incorrectly torqed after a swaybar install.

The bar rate is changed with a thicker bar, which I consider less likely to break or bend or allow body roll, which I consider higher quality.

A part designed to reduce body roll replaced with a part that reduces body roll more is a higher quality part.

Edit; not trying to be argumentative, just trying to explain my position/thoughts.

 

[NightmareMoon]

If the car is lowered, wouldn’t you want to get adjustable end links to correct geometry?

it depends on how much you’ve lowered the car. Sometimes yes, but not ever ride height change requires the endlink lengths to be adjusted.

 

[NightmareMoon]

The bar rate is changed with a thicker bar, which I consider less likely to break or bend or allow body roll, which I consider higher quality.

A part designed to reduce body roll replaced with a part that reduces body roll more is a higher quality part.

yeah thats not what quality means, and swaybars don’t break.

Swaybar rate is a tradeoff. Less roll means less grip most of the time, and a harsher ride. Don’t believe that stiffer sways decrease grip? Thats why we increase the front swaybar rate to increase understeer. Understeer is less grip on that axle.

You need a compliant suspension to grip and ride well. OTOH if you’re getting too much body roll and getting outside the range of movement where the suspension works best, then swaybars can be part of the solution. Also transition speed in slaloms or extremely tight switchbacks is better with a stiffer bar, but slaloms don’t exist on public roads.
suspension design is full of compromises and tradeoffs. There is rarely a ‘best’, it all depends. Track cars will change their setup to tailor to the track they’re driving and weather conditions. In wet conditions you generally want a slower transitioning car that rolls more.

 

[luc]

Under that logic why replace the sway bars? It’s a better part built to higher standards… why replace anything on the car at all that isn’t bent? Increased performance.

Sway bars are typically built pretty well and don’t fail regularly. However, the end links get wear much faster (typically). The wear can cause front end clunk and cause issues that effect the way the sway bar works, even though the sway bar isn’t broken/damaged/worn.

Your post make no sense
Sway bars are replaced to change the torsional rigidity and/or to add adjustability
Nothing to do with improving quality

 

[TrackMustang]

Your post make no sense
Sway bars are replaced to change the torsional rigidity and/or to add adjustability
Nothing to do with improving quality

Your post makes no sense, replacing the sway bar to have less body roll and associating that with quality is crazy.

That’s you. That’s what you sound like.

If you don’t think a Steeda sway bar is higher quality than a stock sway bar then you’re a tard and I don’t care about your opinion.

 

[TrackMustang]

yeah thats not what quality means, and swaybars don’t break.

Swaybar rate is a tradeoff. Less roll means less grip most of the time, and a harsher ride. Don’t believe that stiffer sways decrease grip? Thats why we increase the front swaybar rate to increase understeer. Understeer is less grip on that axle.

You need a compliant suspension to grip and ride well. OTOH if you’re getting too much body roll and getting outside the range of movement where the suspension works best, then swaybars can be part of the solution. Also transition speed in slaloms or extremely tight switchbacks is better with a stiffer bar, but slaloms don’t exist on public roads.
suspension design is full of compromises and tradeoffs. There is rarely a ‘best’, it all depends. Track cars will change their setup to tailor to the track they’re driving and weather conditions. In wet conditions you generally want a slower transitioning car that rolls more.

I promise at some point in human history a sway bar has broken. Of course I suppose it’s possible it was an aftermarket one, but that’s not the point .

I very much disagree, an aftermarket sway bar is head and shoulders above a stock one. If you believe it’s worse to have less body roll I respectfully disagree. Chicanes 100% exist in reality. Maybe not downtown LA, but they are everywhere. Switchbacks are a real thing…

 

[NightmareMoon]

If you believe it’s worse to have less body roll I respectfully disagree. Chicanes 100% exist in reality. Maybe not downtown LA, but they are everywhere. Switchbacks are a real thing…

Are you running both of your aftermarket swaybars on their stiffest adjustment positions?

 

[luc]

Your post makes no sense, replacing the sway bar to have less body roll and associating that with quality is crazy.

That’s you. That’s what you sound like.

If you don’t think a Steeda sway bar is higher quality than a stock sway bar then you’re a tard and I don’t care about your opinion.

Wondering if you do that in purpose just to have an argument
The roll stiffness of a sway bar has nothing to do with quality, go look up the definition of quality, but everything to do with the suspension design that the manufacturer choose, to have the type of ride that they want to have for a particular vehicle
A sport car will have a stiffer ride than a luxury sedan
Nothing to do with quality, simply design choice

 

[TrackMustang]

Wondering if you do that in purpose just to have an argument
The roll stiffness of a sway bar has nothing to do with quality, go look up the definition of quality, but everything to do with the suspension design that the manufacturer choose to have the type of ride that they want to have for a particular vehicle
A sport car will have a stiffer ride than a luxury sedan
Nothing to do with quality, simply design choice

I literally said I’m not trying to argue with another member, and you jump in trying to force the argument and then tell me I’m the one trying to argue. Go away.

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