Lund not tuning for California Customers anymore

[SoCalTim]

There is NO SUCH THING as "49 state legal" or "off-road use only" if the car / truck / bike had a VIN when it was built or has ever been tagged.

They are certainly not the only company to have an off-road use only declaration, I have purchased from a variety of vendors and there has been some sort of disclaimer related to off-road use only.

So, Procharger will not sell their non-CARB kits to CA customers? I purchased a non CARB Procharger kit from a main distributor last year and it shipped from Procharger ATI straight to my home CA address.

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[DCC]

They are certainly not the only company to have an off-road use only declaration, I have purchased from a variety of vendors and there has been some sort of disclaimer related to off-road use only.

It’s a really difficult market to sell into. The Carb and Prop 65 laws are rather vaguely written which allows for different interpretation. (I personally think they are written vaguely so the self-funded Carb board can find more companies in violation.)

Companies have to make their best interpretation of the law to try and stay in compliance.
A smaller company may not have much awareness of Carb law or just not care and sell whatever into California thinking there is little chance of being caught.

Bigger companies have more to lose, may have already been fined, and have had to develop much stronger internal rules.

Jegs was fined close to 2 million dollars for carb violations last year.https://ww2.arb.ca.gov/news/nationw...illion-settle-case-selling-illegal-auto-parts

Each company is left to determine their own policies that they believe are the correct interpretation of Carb laws, so one may sell a product in California and another may choose not to sell it to California.

I would expect the company that sold the Procharger is the company that faces liability in that circumstance. As I understand it, it’s up to the seller to “reasonably” ensure the customer is not using the part sold in an illegal way. ATI is filling the order in good faith that the company that placed the order did that.

 

[NoVaGT]

With California's temporary legal right to set higher emissions standards than Federal standards revoked, are we seeing any changes with this situation?

 

[Rothgray]

That is 100% still illegal and is in NO way actually a way around it.

We won't even waste our time with that, cause it wouldn't hold up in court or anything.
There is NO SUCH THING as "49 state legal" or "off-road use only" if the car / truck / bike had a VIN when it was built or has ever been tagged.

Going to disagree with you here. If the vehicle no longer has a valid registration, the owner can do whatever they wish with it. The moment, it is registered (and in states that have inspections and/or emissions), is when it is considered a road worthy car. Having a VIN is not relevant. The plates would also need to be surrendered back to the state.

This is your free legal advice.

So, yes. If I was representing a parts manufacturer, I would just simply have their customers sign a form that states just that their car is not for DOT road use. If they are caught, it is on them, and transfers all liability from the manufacturer.

The issue with the JEGS case is, that yes, they may have advertised, that some of the parts are not CARB legal, they did not obtain a signed affidavit from the end customer, that their car is not road legal.

 

[V8_MOTOR]

There are a lot of kits which are still CARB approved. Kenne Bell who are actually based in Cali do a full kit plus tune for the Mustang. 700+ HP is plenty.

There are always ways around it. For instance, get the tune and gauge using a port forwarding company or family who live out of town and flash the carb approved tune before inspection etc.

Its the same the word over now though, its getting more and more expensive to be a car guy. The internal combustion engine is literally being choked to death. The irony.

Car ownership is heading towards leasing and subscription etc. To most, cars are purely utilitarian. We are in the minority, just look at how many manufacturers are pulling V8's from their assembly lines.

Its sad but you know horse and cart. I'm sure there were plenty of people who wanted to keep their horses but only those with deep pockets could. Likewise, the internal combustion engine as we know it is heading that way too

 

[2morrow]

There are a lot of kits which are still CARB approved. Kenne Bell who are actually based in Cali do a full kit plus tune for the Mustang. 700+ HP is plenty.

There are always ways around it. For instance, get the tune and gauge using a port forwarding company or family who live out of town and flash the carb approved tune before inspection etc.

Its the same the word over now though, it's getting more and more expensive to be a car guy. The internal combustion engine is literally being choked to death. The irony.

Car ownership is heading towards leasing and subscription etc. To most, cars are purely utilitarian. We are in the minority, just look at how many manufacturers are pulling V8's from their assembly lines.

Its sad but you know horse and cart. I'm sure there were plenty of people who wanted to keep their horses but only those with deep pockets could. Likewise, the internal combustion engine as we know it is heading that way too

Very true as evidenced by the Blue Oval itself:

https://www.ford.com/powertrains/ba...cks=18783868653&emailid=19q4_ford_xxxa_oct_nl

Going back to the original topic, I was having a conversation(s) with my tuner/speed shop partners and they stated that the company that provides my tune
got a visit from the EPA. They conduct business outside of CA and was served a very firm warning with consequences being a MASSIVE monetary fine and even
felony charges.

Because of that there are several other ripple effects that have happened (and more news coming) that make it very hard for a guy like me to make any power mods.
I am of the mindset that my next vehicle will just be one that comes with the right amount of motor performance from the factory (and I'll probably have to pay an ADM)
and i'll just mod other aspects of the vehicle because I can't not tinker with cars...

Unfortunately this is our reality and although sad it's out of our hands.

 

[V8_MOTOR]

Exactly. I completely understand Lund not offering tunes in Cali. It's a simple risk and reward equation. They seem to have made a firm decision that they will not be offering CARB legal tunes for now. That's probably not because they can't do it, its probably because they feel they don't need to.

The Internet allows them to offer tunes the world over now. They may have lost california but they have gained the rest of the world. That purely the business side of it. If I was in their shoes and hearing the stories with regards to EPA enforcement, I'd make exactly the same decision.

Sucks for the guys in Cali but they have many other customers due to the mustang going global.

 

[65sohc]

Ironically e85 is exempt from the most recent additional gas tax because it is cleaner burning. I pay $2.75 for e85 vs. $3.95 for 91.

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