Bump steer on a non-lowered car

[BoostedCanadianPoney]

Guys I need some help and advice regarding bump-steer.

I have been experiencing a lot of issues with my from suspension since my car went through a series of potholes. I had the front driver side dampers changed, the control arm changed and the lower control arm ball joints changed as well. I also had an alignment done.

After this most of my problems were gone except for bump steer. My car is not lowered but the steering would jerk excactly like in this video. What could be the cause?

[ame]

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[Bluemustang]

My understanding is that bumpsteer is unwanted wheel inputs as a result of suspension travel. This should not affect the steering wheel itself but would point the wheels in a direction you don't want to go.

My guess is the problem lies in the tires or alignment. I am not an expert but I have experienced this on my own car. After I had bumpsteer adjusted - no change. Alignment made it better but new tires made the biggest difference.

Maybe an expert can chime in to say if my thoughts on this are more or less correct.

 

[BoostedCanadianPoney]

Thanks for the input. Its exactly what is happening the steering would resist and point in a direction to the left where I dont want to go. I did have an alignment done which did not solve the problem. I will check the tires once again

 

[jbailer]

So this is in your Ram pickup right? From the video, you can't really see what you're hitting. Are both wheels hitting the same amount of bump at the same time or are you hitting a hole with your left tire? It seems like it's always jerking left which would be expected if you're hitting a pothole with the left tire. Guessing that is not the case from your first post, it sounds to me like you hit something with the front left and there is still resulting damage. I don't know all the parts in the Ram suspension but what hasn't been replaced? Upper and lower control arms, tie rod (didn't see that mentioned)? I'd at least inspect the right side as well. If you're hitting the same bump with both wheels at the same time, that's not bump steer, that is resulting damage from whatever happened earlier.

Sorry, I shouldn't say not bump steer because it likely is but more a result of damage than design. I'm betting you will find a bent tie rod. I'm surprised whatever it is wasn't noticed during the alignment. Unless the same place that did the repair also did the alignment.

 

[kn7671]

the control arm changed and the lower control arm ball joints changed as well. I also had an alignment done.

After this most of my problems were gone except for bump steer. My car is not lowered but the steering would jerk excactly like in this video. What could be the cause?

These cars don't really encounter bump steer on stock springs.

Curious, are you aware there are two lower control arms and two ball joints on the drivers front suspension? To my knowledge, these ball joints are not serviceable or replaceable, and are included in the new control arm(s).

Regardless, if you did damage bad enough to bend or damage components in the front suspension, and you did not replace everything where the impact occurred, chances are something is still bent.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor

While it may align correctly on a rack, bent parts show up during suspension movement or travel when it alters suspension geometry in a new modified undesired motion, causing what you're sensing as bump steer.

Lastly, depending on how bad this impact was, there's always a chance the subframe on the drivers front corner was tweaked a little. Again, depending on many variables, the car may still align on an alignment rack. These things have to be checked out at a body collision repair shop where they can validate the entire vehicle's subframe.

 

[jbailer]

These cars don't really encounter bump steer on stock springs.

Curious, are you aware there are two lower control arms and two ball joints on the drivers front suspension? To my knowledge, these ball joints are not serviceable or replaceable, and are included in the new control arm(s).

Regardless, if you did damage bad enough to bend or damage components in the front suspension, and you did not replace everything where the impact occurred, chances are something is still bent.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor

While it may align correctly on a rack, bent parts show up during suspension movement or travel when it alters suspension geometry in a new modified undesired motion, causing what you're sensing as bump steer.

Lastly, depending on how bad this impact was, there's always a chance the subframe on the drivers front corner was tweaked a little. Again, depending on many variables, the car may still align on an alignment rack. These things have to be checked out at a body collision repair shop where they can validate the entire vehicle's subframe.

I'm pretty sure the problem he's talking about is with his Ram pickup rather than his Mustang. Maybe not? Maybe the video is just similar to his problem?

 

[BoostedCanadianPoney]

I'm pretty sure the problem he's talking about is with his Ram pickup rather than his Mustang. Maybe not? Maybe the video is just similar to his problem?

Sorry if I was unlear. I am talking about my mustang. This video is just an illustration of what I am experiencing. My car does the same thing the steering would randomly jerk to the left and I have to hold it to keep th ecar straight, it would fight me. I don'tunderstand what else to to do. Again what was changed is the front driver side control arm, the shock and the lower control arm ball joint. They also did an alignment. The car is by no means undrivable as it doesnt do it all the time. But I know it is not normal that the car just steers in one way and I have to always adjust my steering. I tought it was a wheel/tire issue but the front tires have the same threadware and same psi. what should I look for ??

 

[jbailer]

Oh my bad. The fact that you're saying it always pulls to the left means that there is damage. I'm betting it's going to be your end link is bent. If you had to replace all that, I'm shocked you didn't replace the end link. They are VERY thin and spindly. People are bending them just with hard cornering and track use.

 

[BoostedCanadianPoney]

These cars don't really encounter bump steer on stock springs.

Regardless, if you did damage bad enough to bend or damage components in the front suspension, and you did not replace everything where the impact occurred, chances are something is still bent.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor

THIS. Thanks for the input, what you describe is what I am suspecting is going on, something is bent somewho, but how I test it. Dealership went for a test drive and they say its fine. Like you said for what I am experiencing there could be many explanations. Just so annoying I had to go to two diffrent dealerships several times to have them change the parts, yet the car still doesnt drive normally

 

[BoostedCanadianPoney]

Oh my bad. The fact that you're saying it always pulls to the left means that there is damage. I'm betting it's going to be your end link is bent. If you had to replace all that, I'm shocked you didn't replace the end link. They are VERY thin and spindly. People are bending them just with hard cornering and track use.

I will look for any signs of bent end links. I hope this is it but I would be surprised that they wouldnt have spotted this issue when they replaced all the parts. Thanks jbailer

 

[jbailer]

THIS. Thanks for the input, what you describe is what I am suspecting is going on, something is bent somewho, but how I test it. Dealership went for a test drive and they say its fine. Like you said for what I am experiencing there could be many explanations. Just so annoying I had to go to two diffrent dealerships several times to have them change the parts, yet the car still doesnt drive normally

Just climb under it and look at the end link. It'll be easy to see if it's bent.

Also, look on the other side. Maybe they're just micro focused on 1 side and they missed the other side.

 

[BoostedCanadianPoney]

Will do. But my steering is MUCH more loose when I turn it to the left, and is more stiff when I turn it to the right. I just hope it will get resolved soon. Will update the post once I figure it out.

 

[Bluemustang]

Get a copy of your alignment specs. Maybe you have excessive cross caster. From what I've read that can cause a pull and can cause the steering resistance to be different left to right. Even if it is "in spec" does not mean it is good enough. Just trying to suggest another idea.

You may also be experiencing tramlining really bad too which can happen based on tires and suspension, among other things. A tighter and lowered suspension can cause the car to follow road irregularities more easily. I've experienced some of these same issues and was fortunately able to solve it. New tires and really dialing in my front end alignment with CC plates made a world of difference. I cannot be sure adjusting caster improved my situation but I had decent cross caster settings from the factory. And lowering the suspension didn't help my other alignment specs either. But with the CC plates my shop was able to correct my cross caster and make them even on both sides. And front toe set to 0.00 on both sides. I may have to countersteer a bit on a road that is more crowned, but I would rather do that and know my alignment geometry is correct. The car is supposed to respond to the road. But it's when you feel you're not in control is when it's a problem. So I know what feels like and it can be frustrating believe me.

 

[VinnAY]

Ive been experiencing less of the wheel sawing left/right in turns over bumps when I took it off "sport" steering and to "normal"...just something I'm messing with. I do not like this electric steering rack, like another post above it feels different to the left than to the right in quick motions.

 

[BoostedCanadianPoney]

Get a copy of your alignment specs. Maybe you have excessive cross caster. From what I've read that can cause a pull and can cause the steering resistance to be different left to right. Even if it is "in spec" does not mean it is good enough. Just trying to suggest another idea.

You may also be experiencing tramlining really bad too which can happen based on tires and suspension, among other things. A tighter and lowered suspension can cause the car to follow road irregularities more easily. I've experienced some of these same issues and was fortunately able to solve it. New tires and really dialing in my front end alignment with CC plates made a world of difference. I cannot be sure adjusting caster improved my situation but I had decent cross caster settings from the factory. And lowering the suspension didn't help my other alignment specs either. But with the CC plates my shop was able to correct my cross caster and make them even on both sides. And front toe set to 0.00 on both sides. I may have to countersteer a bit on a road that is more crowned, but I would rather do that and know my alignment geometry is correct. The car is supposed to respond to the road. But it's when you feel you're not in control is when it's a problem. So I know what feels like and it can be frustrating believe me.

Thanks for the input. It is really frustrating having to fight the steering at random times. Would you say I can benefit from CC plates to dial my alignment even if my car is not lowered? My understanding is I dont really need them since im on stock PP springs. I did rotate my tires from rears to front 3 weeks ago, I am running the stock PP square set up. I wanted to limit the wear. Also my right front wheel is new (replaced with a stock OE PP wheel bought here on M6G) as I curbed my original one. I had the tire mounted and properly balanced tought, not sure there is an issue there

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