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Anyone Running E30 Fuel Mixture On A Stock Tune?

loco_GT350

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Okay guys, I have been watching a lot of people run a performance tune (i.e. Lund Racing) on their GT350’s but I am too chicken to do that right now since my car still has 3 years of warranty left on it. Nevertheless I would like to get a little more performance (HP) out of my car.

I have experimented with both a full tank of 100 octane race gas as well as a mixture of 100 octane race gas mixed with 91 octane standard gas which works out to ~94 octane. I have not tested this on a chassis dyno but the butt dyno tells me the car runs stronger in both cases then on standard 91 octane gas. I have run a number of tanks at 94 octane and then went back to 91 and I could tell the car felt a little flat footed compared to when I run on 94.

Given the cost of race fuel in my area is approx $8-$9 a gallon it got me to thinking about playing around with ethanol fuel to try to create an equivalent 94 octane fuel that was cheaper. Here in Arizona where I live there is only one station in town that sells true E85 all the others sell E54 (Arizona government rules mandate ethanol fuel for flex fuel cars be E54, you can about it on the web if you are interested). Anyway I did some analysis and figured out that 5 gallons of E54 mixed with 11 gallons of standard 91 octane fuel creates an equivalent mixture of 94 octane and which works out to be E30 fuel.

I was wondering if anyone else has done this mixture or an equivalent one on a stock tune. Seems to me that this mixture would provide the same benefits of the race fuel mixture but at a lower cost. Since the amount of ethanol is relatively low I would think the air/fuel system and stock tune should be able to handle it and take advantage of the higher octane.

So what do you guys think? Anyone see any flaws, issues, concerns with running E30 fuel? Anyone run a similar type of blend fuel using ethanol on the stock tune?
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ClayDee

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The Ford Racing GT350 Supplement/Manual clearly states not to use fuel containing over 15% ethanol. See page 23 of the manual.

Good luck!
 

jpindustrie

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Ya... no ethanol more than the manual states , stock...

Race gas at $10/ gal up here at my local Sunoco off the GWB does give some cheap thrills though
 
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loco_GT350

loco_GT350

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Thanks guys, I knew the min was 91 octane and 93 was preferred but did not think to look in the manual for ethanol fuel guidance. I suspect the manual states what it does because at the time the GT350 was designed (and I believe is still pretty much the case around the US today) is that E85 is the most common type of ethanol fuel blend you can find at an average gas station that is greater then 15%. I’m not sure how common E54 fuel is outside of Arizona. Nevertheless I believe the manual was written with E85 in mind and the car is clearly not setup to run straight E85 without a tune and possibly bigger injectors.

I was thinking with the ethanol content being 30% that maybe it was okay but with the manual stating nothing over 15% it is not worth the risk to experiment with E30. I did run the numbers again and it looks like I can mix 2 gallons of E85 to 14 gallons of 91 octane to create an E13 mix with an octane of 93. Since this mets the ethanol requirements I might experiment with this blend.
 

ZX3ST

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Not sure about AZ, but here in MO 100% gasoline is tough to find. The pumps state the fuel could have up to 10% Ethanol already. Just a point to consider in your calculations.
 

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loco_GT350

loco_GT350

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Not sure about AZ, but here in MO 100% gasoline is tough to find. The pumps state the fuel could have up to 10% Ethanol already. Just a point to consider in your calculations.
ZX3ST, excellent point! I forgot to account for that in the 91 fuel in my calculations. Here is AZ it is also up to 10% ethanol as well. Thanks!
 

Shift

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Honestly, if you're going to cheap out on wringing out more performance, I'd rather try a octane booster(however effective/ineffective) than to try to run an irregular ethanol mix on a stock tune. Seems like you're trying to eat your cake and have it too.
 
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loco_GT350

loco_GT350

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[QUOTE="Seems like you're trying to eat your cake and have it too.[/QUOTE]

Absolutely! LOL. Honestly I was trying to figure out if there was a more cost effective way to get 93+ octane fuel using ethanol given they don’t sell 93 in AZ. After running the numbers and staying within the 15% ethanol spec the best I can do is 92 octane which is only a point better and not worth the inconvenience.

I have looked into the octane booster and a couple of brands seem to have data to backup their claims. The reason I decided to not go this route is that people have said that after awhile this stuff leaves an orange residue inside the engine (there are pictures out on the web showing the residue on spark plugs).

In the end I have come full circle and will just stick with my race fuel mixture until the warranty is up and then go with an ethanol tune.
 
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loco_GT350

loco_GT350

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65sohc, thanks for posting this, it was definitely an interesting read. I suspect the GT350 could probably handle E30 but because the manual states nothing above E15 I don’t want to deal with any potential warranty issues. This is something that I will try out once the car is out of warranty. I will also get a tune for it at that point as well.
 

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65sohc

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This topic got me thinking so I did a fair amount of research. There is significant evidence that the "blend wall", as it is called, of 15% ethanol is a result of oil company pressure to limit ethanol rather than actual real world data showing that higher ethanol concentrations are detrimental.The reason that manufacturers limit it to e15 is because is there is no ethanol blend available from a single pump between 15 and 85%. ie. The only way to get e30 is to mix e85 and regular gasoline, a process, apparently,far beyond the capabilities of most owners, The e30 Challenge involved over 100,000 miles of real world data obtained via EPA approved data loggers. The result was that no CEL were triggered as the maximum long term fuel trim was 11%, far below the 25% required to trigger a CEL. No engine failures have been reported during the course of the study and beyond. I told my son to put e30 in his GT350, to counteract the handicap of California 91, and if his engine dies I'll buy him a new one.
 
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loco_GT350

loco_GT350

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65sohc, if your son puts E30 in his GT350 let me know how it goes and what he thinks.
 

oldmachguy

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FWIW, I had a tribologist recommend I run a tank of E30 about every fifth to eighth tank. I’ve done it less frequently than that. 4.25 gal of E85 and 11.75 gal of 93 (E10) makes 16 gal of E30 with 96 octane. Injectors are not maxed out. Mileage sucks but car runs noticeably stronger. Not as good as with a tank of 102 mixed up using MS109, but still good and a lot cheaper. Fun to do after a fresh oil and air filter change. 36k miles on a DD R and no issues.

BTW, when running straight 93, which is the rest of the time, I get annoying valve clatter / spark knock frequently with mild throttle roll on in say 2nd, 3rd, 4th and sometimes 5th - which makes me lift. 102 made it disappear. 94 (ie, fill up with 93 with a gal of 102 left in the tank) still no knock. And it took like 3 more tanks of 93 before it returned, which it did emphatically.

It’s not piston slap - I know that sound well.

Anyone else? Anyone have any diagnosis for me?
 

sox3

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If you can find Toluene at a resonable price it has an octane of about 114. Works great to raise octane. I know as i ran the gasoline blender for Sunoco.
 

BlackandBlue

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If you put 0% E 93 octane and mix it with E85 you can get a marginal boost in octane.

16gal
13.6 of 93
2.4gal of E85

Small bump in octane.
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